Edip Yuksel

THE NINETEEN QUESTIONS FOR CHRISTIAN CLERGY

by Edip Yuksel

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QUESTION 15 Why do you abuse and ignore Biblical verses? In this chapter we will examine some verses which have been abused by the clergy in order to support their corrupted teachings. Even though we assume the following verses to be the original words of Jesus, the traditional meanings ascribed to them and conclusions derived from them are merely biased interpretations and personal imaginations. John 8:57,58 "Then said the Jews unto him, You are not yet fifty years old, and you have seen Abraham? Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am." The clergy asserts that this verse provides the evidence that Jesus claimed his deity. However, this is far away from the truth. This verse cannot provide any status of deity for Jesus. According to the Bible, all the human race was created before the creation of earth. Solomon, Jeremiah, also share pre-existence with Jesus (Proverbs 8:22-27; Jer 1:4,5). The speculation on "I am" is not worthy to discuss here. It is an ordinary "I am," as "you are." John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God." "So, Jesus is God" concludes clergymen after quoting the above verse. We cannot agree for two reasons, at least: 1. These are not the words of Jesus himself. They are not the words of John either. Objective Christian scholars acknowledge that they are the words of Philo of Alexandria, who lived before Jesus was born. Thus, it is a quotation without reference. 2. The capital letters in the translation are misleading. The word "God" which occurs twice are not the same in the Greek manuscripts. The first one is "Hotheos" which can be translated as "The god" or "God," the second one is "Tontheos" which can be translated as "a god" or "god". The abuse of capital letters, commas, and full stops are widespread in translations. For instance, the Greek word "Hotheos" (God) occurs twice in 2 Corinthians. However, the English translations distinguish them by the manipulation of capital letters. John 20:28 "Thomas said in response, 'My Lord and my God!'" Although we know that John is the latest and the least authentic Gospel (see Question 3), we assume that Thomas told Jesus, "My Lord and my God!" Before evaluating this verse, let's summarize the common clergy approach by quoting from Josh Mc Dowel & Bart Larson: "There is no mistaking that Thomas's words were addressed to Jesus. Thomas used both titles to express his understanding of Christ's deity and lordship. Jesus did not rebuke Thomas for blasphemy. Instead, He accepted those titles of deity." (Jesus: A Biblical Defence of His Deity, p 27). However, if we read the context (from the verse 24 to 30) the case is very different. After burial of Jesus, his body disappears. Then Jesus appears to Mary Magdalene and other disciples except Thomas, one of the Twelve (John 20:24). He hears the resurrection story and says, "I will not believe it." (20:24). Please note that the topic is not Jesus' deity, it is his resurrection. So, he says that he does not believe "it", that is, the story. A week later Jesus appears to him physically and Thomas is in a great excitement: "My God, my Lord!" are the words he could utter. He does not say, "You are my God and my Lord." His words are ordinary words that all of us use frequently in our life when we witness an incredible event. The identity of the utterer of these words also refutes clergy's interpretation. A stranger, or a disbeliever is not saying these words. He is Thomas, one of the few who followed Christ to death: "Then Thomas said to the rest of the disciples, 'Let us also go, that we may die with him.' " (John 11: 16). If this very Thomas did not believe Jesus and "his deity," until after his death, then why was he following him? What kind of disciple was he that he could not understand the most important message, which caused Christ's crucifixion? Was he a retarded disciple? There is another option: he understood Jesus, but did not believe him. Apparently, the clergy opt this alternative by claiming that Thomas finally believed Jesus' deity after his resurrection. According to this theory, Thomas was another hypocrite among the disciples besides Judas Iscariot. Judas made money. But, why did Thomas act as a believer until the crucifixion of Jesus? Why was he saying, 'Let us also go, that we may die with him'? There are many other problems related to the story of resurrection. The obvious contradictions between the Gospels and "their disjointed, blurred and disordered character" (Father Roguet, Initiation a l'Evangile, p. 182) need our attention which is beyond the scope of this book. John 10:30 "I and my Father are one." This verse is one of the most abused verses in the Bible. We assume that Jesus Christ uttered this statement. To understand the intention and purpose of this statement we have to look at its context. If we read verses 24 to 39 carefully, we will find out that this unity is not in Nature, neither in Omniscience, nor in Omnipotence; it is in purpose. Sure, Jesus and God were one in purpose as stated: "The one who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases him." (John 8:29). The simple-minded Pharisees and their followers were looking for excuses to accuse Jesus of blasphemy. They were not the people who were willing to understand Jesus: "This is why I speak to them in parables: Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand." (Matthew 13:13). Ironically, clergymen present the Pharisee's mind as criteria for interpretation of Jesus' words. But, Jesus sarcastically rejects this logic (John 10:33), by reminding them of the usage of word "gods" in the Old Testament (John 10:34-36). Jesus refers to Psalm 82:6 which reads: "I have said you are gods; and all of you are children of the most High." Jesus, after reminding them of the usage of "gods" for good men in their own scripture, now asks them: "Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's son'?" (John 10:36). The Bible teaches us that Jesus is not unique to be "one in the Father." The verses below explains John 10:30 clearly: "My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me." "I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one: I in them and you in me. May they be brought to complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me." (John 17:20-23). As an answer to one of my articles published in a newsletter questioning the doctrine of Trinity, I received a letter from the American Bible Society, New York. The back of the letter was filled with references to the verses of the Old Testament in order to support the traditional misinterpretations on John 10:30. So, let's see what those abused verses by Trinitarians are? We will evaluate two of them. Isaiah 7:14 "Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel." Immanuel means "God with us". Obviously, it doesn't mean "This is God," or "God". In Jewish tradition it was common to name a child or a place with a phrase reminding or praising God. For instance, the place where David defeated Philistines was called Baal Perazim, which means The Lord Who Breaks Out (1 Chronicles 14:11). David's wife named her son Samuel, which means Heard of God (1 Samuel 1:20). Solomon's other name Jedidah means Loved by the Lord (2 Samuel 12:25)... Isaiah 9:6 "For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." The long name is deliberately mistranslated in order to justify the deity of Jesus. The Hebrew words are: Pele-joez-el-gibbor-Abi-ad-sar-shalom. The correct translation of this long name: Wonderful in counsel is God the Mighty, the Everlasting Father, the Ruler of Peace. Evidently, the correct translation does not leave room for an incarnated god. It is another praising phrase commonly used in those days. Furthermore, this verse has nothing to do with Jesus. It is about a contemporary person, most likely, Hezekiah. The ignored verses From the New Testament and the Final Testament as well, we learn that Jesus was a human messenger of God whose sole mission was to deliver God's message. The following verses are only a sample of many Biblical verses which are deliberately ignored by the clergy: "I cannot do anything of myself. I judge as I hear, and my judgment is honest because I am not seeking my own will but the will of Him who sent me." (John 5:30). "Jesus said: 'My doctrine is not my own; it comes from Him who sent me.'" (John 7:16). "... If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I." (John 14:28). "As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. 'Good teacher,' he asked, 'what must I do to inherit eternal life?' Jesus answered, 'Why do you call me good? No one is good--except God alone.'" (Mark 10:17-18; Matthew 19:16-17; Luke 18:18-19). "Whoever welcomes me welcomes, not me, but Him who sent me." (Matthew 10:40; Mark 9:37; Luke 9:48 & John 13:20). "... I have not come of myself. I was sent by One who has the right to send, and Him you do not know. I know Him because it is from Him I come; he sent me." (John 7:28-29). "'The most important one,' answered Jesus, 'is this: Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.' " (Mark 12:29). "None of those who call me 'Lord' will enter the kingdom of God, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven." (Matthew 7:21). "... Go to my brothers and tell them, 'I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.' " (John 20:17). The real source of the Trinity Then, why do the clergy preach the Trinity? Why do Christendom not pay attention to the whole Old Testament, and the majority of the New Testament? Here are the so-called defense of two self-appointed lawyers. They exhibit such a clumsy defense that they blunder in the following statements: "This discussion can get complicated, depending on what a person has been taught. Arguments can be made both for and against the deity of Christ. For example, if one has been taught that God is one person and that Jesus is a created being, then on first reading, Bible verses can be found to support that view. On the other hand, if one has been taught that God is one supreme being comprised Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and that the Son gave up His position of equality within the godhead to become a man in the person of Jesus, then Scripture passages can be found to support that view." (Jesus A Biblical Defence of His Diety, Josh McDowel & Bart Larson, Campus Crusade for Christ, California, p. 15) Here are two Trinitarian Christian slipping up the source of the three equal godhead. If we cannot get the Trinity from the Bible, then which authority will teach it to us? Besides, The Old Testament does not preach God being comprised of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Here are the questions: 1. What can be the sources for the teachings of monotheism, and trinitarianism? 2. Why do you use John 8:57-58 as a Biblical evidence for the deity of Jesus? Do Jeremiah, Solomon, Job also not share pre-existence with Jesus (Jer 1:4,5; Proverbs 8:22-26; Job 38:21)? 3. According to Greek manuscripts, "the Word was God" (John 1:1) should be translated as "the word was god." Why do you abuse the capital letters? 4. Why do you use a small "g" for "God" when referring to Moses (Exodus 7:1) instead of a capital "G" as you do for a mere word -'WORD'- (John 1:1)? Why do you play fast and loose with the Word of God? 5. Why do you claim that Thomas did not believe Jesus until he saw him resurrected? Did he not witness many of his miracles? Did he not follow him despite all the risks? Wasn't he the bravest of all disciples who suggested 'Let us also go, that we may die with him.' " (John 11: 16)? What was the topic in John 20:28 that made him say "My Lord and my God!"? Was the topic the deity of Jesus, or his resurrection? Why didn't he say "You are my Lord and my God"? Do we not say "My God!" with excitement when we encounter an incredible event? 6. The word "God" can be an insertion by the translators into John 20:28. Assuming this probability we can ask the following question: The title "lord" is used for humans throughout the Bible as well as for God. For instance, "Do not be angry, my lord," says Aaron to Moses in Exodus 32:22. Since we know that Hebrew and Greek do not have capital letters, what made you write the "lord" in John 20:28 as "Lord"? 7. Why do you take John 10:30 out of context? When Jesus told Jews that "I and my Father are one." he was obviously telling them that they are one in purpose. Why do you ignore the verses which clarify its meaning such as "... that they may be one as we are one: I in them and you in me" (John 17: 23 & 8:29)? 8. You speculate on the name "Immanuel" in Isaiah 7:14 in order to create an incarnated god. Then, why do you ignore similar names, such as Baal Perazim (1 Chronicles 14:11) and Samuel (1 Samuel 1:20). 9. Why do you mistranslate the long name in Isaiah 9:6? What is your reason of not accepting it for a contemporary person? 10. Why do you ignore numerous verses which leave no room for Trinity, and the deity of Jesus?

Moslem Questions on Christianity Edip Yuksel P.O. Box 43476, Tucson, AZ 85733-3476 U.S.A. Tel/Fax: (520) 323-7636

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	QUESTION 15 Why do you abuse and ignore Biblical verses? In this chapter we will examine some verses which have been abused by the clergy in order to support their corrupted teachings. Even though we assume the following verses to be the original words of Jesus, the traditional meanings ascribed to them and conclusions derived from them are merely biased interpretations and personal imaginations. John 8:57,58 "Then said the Jews unto him, You are not yet fifty years old, and you have seen Abraham? Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am." The clergy asserts that this verse provides the evidence that Jesus claimed his deity. However, this is far away from the truth. This verse cannot provide any status of deity for Jesus. According to the Bible, all the human race was created before the creation of earth. Solomon, Jeremiah, also share pre-existence with Jesus (Proverbs 8:22-27; Jer 1:4,5). The speculation on "I am" is not worthy to discuss here. It is an ordinary "I am," as "you are." John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God." "So, Jesus is God" concludes clergymen after quoting the above verse. We cannot agree for two reasons, at least: 1. These are not the words of Jesus himself. They are not the words of John either. Objective Christian scholars acknowledge that they are the words of Philo of Alexandria, who lived before Jesus was born. Thus, it is a quotation without reference. 2. The capital letters in the translation are misleading. The word "God" which occurs twice are not the same in the Greek manuscripts. The first one is "Hotheos" which can be translated as "The god" or "God," the second one is "Tontheos" which can be translated as "a god" or "god". The abuse of capital letters, commas, and full stops are widespread in translations. For instance, the Greek word "Hotheos" (God) occurs twice in 2 Corinthians. However, the English translations distinguish them by the manipulation of capital letters. John 20:28 "Thomas said in response, 'My Lord and my God!'" Although we know that John is the latest and the least authentic Gospel (see Question 3), we assume that Thomas told Jesus, "My Lord and my God!" Before evaluating this verse, let's summarize the common clergy approach by quoting from Josh Mc Dowel & Bart Larson: "There is no mistaking that Thomas's words were addressed to Jesus. Thomas used both titles to express his understanding of Christ's deity and lordship. Jesus did not rebuke Thomas for blasphemy. Instead, He accepted those titles of deity." (Jesus: A Biblical Defence of His Deity, p 27). However, if we read the context (from the verse 24 to 30) the case is very different. After burial of Jesus, his body disappears. Then Jesus appears to Mary Magdalene and other disciples except Thomas, one of the Twelve (John 20:24). He hears the resurrection story and says, "I will not believe it." (20:24). Please note that the topic is not Jesus' deity, it is his resurrection. So, he says that he does not believe "it", that is, the story. A week later Jesus appears to him physically and Thomas is in a great excitement: "My God, my Lord!" are the words he could utter. He does not say, "You are my God and my Lord." His words are ordinary words that all of us use frequently in our life when we witness an incredible event. The identity of the utterer of these words also refutes clergy's interpretation. A stranger, or a disbeliever is not saying these words. He is Thomas, one of the few who followed Christ to death: "Then Thomas said to the rest of the disciples, 'Let us also go, that we may die with him.' " (John 11: 16). If this very Thomas did not believe Jesus and "his deity," until after his death, then why was he following him? What kind of disciple was he that he could not understand the most important message, which caused Christ's crucifixion? Was he a retarded disciple? There is another option: he understood Jesus, but did not believe him. Apparently, the clergy opt this alternative by claiming that Thomas finally believed Jesus' deity after his resurrection. According to this theory, Thomas was another hypocrite among the disciples besides Judas Iscariot. Judas made money. But, why did Thomas act as a believer until the crucifixion of Jesus? Why was he saying, 'Let us also go, that we may die with him'? There are many other problems related to the story of resurrection. The obvious contradictions between the Gospels and "their disjointed, blurred and disordered character" (Father Roguet, Initiation a l'Evangile, p. 182) need our attention which is beyond the scope of this book. John 10:30 "I and my Father are one." This verse is one of the most abused verses in the Bible. We assume that Jesus Christ uttered this statement. To understand the intention and purpose of this statement we have to look at its context. If we read verses 24 to 39 carefully, we will find out that this unity is not in Nature, neither in Omniscience, nor in Omnipotence; it is in purpose. Sure, Jesus and God were one in purpose as stated: "The one who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases him." (John 8:29). The simple-minded Pharisees and their followers were looking for excuses to accuse Jesus of blasphemy. They were not the people who were willing to understand Jesus: "This is why I speak to them in parables: Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand." (Matthew 13:13). Ironically, clergymen present the Pharisee's mind as criteria for interpretation of Jesus' words. But, Jesus sarcastically rejects this logic (John 10:33), by reminding them of the usage of word "gods" in the Old Testament (John 10:34-36). Jesus refers to Psalm 82:6 which reads: "I have said you are gods; and all of you are children of the most High." Jesus, after reminding them of the usage of "gods" for good men in their own scripture, now asks them: "Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's son'?" (John 10:36). The Bible teaches us that Jesus is not unique to be "one in the Father." The verses below explains John 10:30 clearly: "My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me." "I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one: I in them and you in me. May they be brought to complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me." (John 17:20-23). As an answer to one of my articles published in a newsletter questioning the doctrine of Trinity, I received a letter from the American Bible Society, New York. The back of the letter was filled with references to the verses of the Old Testament in order to support the traditional misinterpretations on John 10:30. So, let's see what those abused verses by Trinitarians are? We will evaluate two of them. Isaiah 7:14 "Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel." Immanuel means "God with us". Obviously, it doesn't mean "This is God," or "God". In Jewish tradition it was common to name a child or a place with a phrase reminding or praising God. For instance, the place where David defeated Philistines was called Baal Perazim, which means The Lord Who Breaks Out (1 Chronicles 14:11). David's wife named her son Samuel, which means Heard of God (1 Samuel 1:20). Solomon's other name Jedidah means Loved by the Lord (2 Samuel 12:25)... Isaiah 9:6 "For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." The long name is deliberately mistranslated in order to justify the deity of Jesus. The Hebrew words are: Pele-joez-el-gibbor-Abi-ad-sar-shalom. The correct translation of this long name: Wonderful in counsel is God the Mighty, the Everlasting Father, the Ruler of Peace. Evidently, the correct translation does not leave room for an incarnated god. It is another praising phrase commonly used in those days. Furthermore, this verse has nothing to do with Jesus. It is about a contemporary person, most likely, Hezekiah. The ignored verses From the New Testament and the Final Testament as well, we learn that Jesus was a human messenger of God whose sole mission was to deliver God's message. The following verses are only a sample of many Biblical verses which are deliberately ignored by the clergy: "I cannot do anything of myself. I judge as I hear, and my judgment is honest because I am not seeking my own will but the will of Him who sent me." (John 5:30). "Jesus said: 'My doctrine is not my own; it comes from Him who sent me.'" (John 7:16). "... If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I." (John 14:28). "As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. 'Good teacher,' he asked, 'what must I do to inherit eternal life?' Jesus answered, 'Why do you call me good? No one is good--except God alone.'" (Mark 10:17-18; Matthew 19:16-17; Luke 18:18-19). "Whoever welcomes me welcomes, not me, but Him who sent me." (Matthew 10:40; Mark 9:37; Luke 9:48 & John 13:20). "... I have not come of myself. I was sent by One who has the right to send, and Him you do not know. I know Him because it is from Him I come; he sent me." (John 7:28-29). "'The most important one,' answered Jesus, 'is this: Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.' " (Mark 12:29). "None of those who call me 'Lord' will enter the kingdom of God, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven." (Matthew 7:21). "... Go to my brothers and tell them, 'I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.' " (John 20:17). The real source of the Trinity Then, why do the clergy preach the Trinity? Why do Christendom not pay attention to the whole Old Testament, and the majority of the New Testament? Here are the so-called defense of two self-appointed lawyers. They exhibit such a clumsy defense that they blunder in the following statements: "This discussion can get complicated, depending on what a person has been taught. Arguments can be made both for and against the deity of Christ. For example, if one has been taught that God is one person and that Jesus is a created being, then on first reading, Bible verses can be found to support that view. On the other hand, if one has been taught that God is one supreme being comprised Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and that the Son gave up His position of equality within the godhead to become a man in the person of Jesus, then Scripture passages can be found to support that view." (Jesus A Biblical Defence of His Diety, Josh McDowel & Bart Larson, Campus Crusade for Christ, California, p. 15) Here are two Trinitarian Christian slipping up the source of the three equal godhead. If we cannot get the Trinity from the Bible, then which authority will teach it to us? Besides, The Old Testament does not preach God being comprised of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Here are the questions: 1. What can be the sources for the teachings of monotheism, and trinitarianism? 2. Why do you use John 8:57-58 as a Biblical evidence for the deity of Jesus? Do Jeremiah, Solomon, Job also not share pre-existence with Jesus (Jer 1:4,5; Proverbs 8:22-26; Job 38:21)? 3. According to Greek manuscripts, "the Word was God" (John 1:1) should be translated as "the word was god." Why do you abuse the capital letters? 4. Why do you use a small "g" for "God" when referring to Moses (Exodus 7:1) instead of a capital "G" as you do for a mere word -'WORD'- (John 1:1)? Why do you play fast and loose with the Word of God? 5. Why do you claim that Thomas did not believe Jesus until he saw him resurrected? Did he not witness many of his miracles? Did he not follow him despite all the risks? Wasn't he the bravest of all disciples who suggested 'Let us also go, that we may die with him.' " (John 11: 16)? What was the topic in John 20:28 that made him say "My Lord and my God!"? Was the topic the deity of Jesus, or his resurrection? Why didn't he say "You are my Lord and my God"? Do we not say "My God!" with excitement when we encounter an incredible event? 6. The word "God" can be an insertion by the translators into John 20:28. Assuming this probability we can ask the following question: The title "lord" is used for humans throughout the Bible as well as for God. For instance, "Do not be angry, my lord," says Aaron to Moses in Exodus 32:22. Since we know that Hebrew and Greek do not have capital letters, what made you write the "lord" in John 20:28 as "Lord"? 7. Why do you take John 10:30 out of context? When Jesus told Jews that "I and my Father are one." he was obviously telling them that they are one in purpose. Why do you ignore the verses which clarify its meaning such as "... that they may be one as we are one: I in them and you in me" (John 17: 23 & 8:29)? 8. You speculate on the name "Immanuel" in Isaiah 7:14 in order to create an incarnated god. Then, why do you ignore similar names, such as Baal Perazim (1 Chronicles 14:11) and Samuel (1 Samuel 1:20). 9. Why do you mistranslate the long name in Isaiah 9:6? What is your reason of not accepting it for a contemporary person? 10. Why do you ignore numerous verses which leave no room for Trinity, and the deity of Jesus?
	Moslem Questions on Christianity Edip Yuksel P.O. Box 43476, Tucson, AZ 85733-3476 U.S.A. Tel/Fax: (520) 323-7636
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